7/22/2005
the quicksand known as Joe Wilson
Well now having travelled the sphere and having dug up some interesting little pearls of wisdom, I came upon this piece by Joe Mowbray at Frontpage Magazine. The tag line for this post is taken from this sentence in the piece:
There’s just one hitch: their entire political case rests on the quicksand known as Joe Wilson.
Quicksand. You know, the stuff that people walk into because it looks like solid ground, only to get sucked in, and unable to get out without someone’s help–and if nobody is around, you just disappear? heh. Quicksand.
But the Left’s entire rationale for the “Fire Rove” tidal wave is that revealing Valerie Plame’s status as a CIA employee was nothing more than a “shameful,” “despicable,” and “disturbing” act of “retaliation,” “retribution,” or “revenge.” If they admitted that Wilson layered lies upon lies, then logic dictates that Rove did no more than encourage a reporter not to be hoodwinked.
uh huh. And that’s what makes Joe Wilson “quicksand”. You can’t stand on solid ground when your “truth” is actually a bunch of trumped up lies and looks like it’s been shot full of holes–like a piece of swiss cheese. Now, let’s look carefully for the nuance to the story…because things are not always as they seem. Don’t forget: Quicksand.
Although Wilson didn’t directly say that he was sent by the Vice-President’s office, the implication couldn’t have been clearer. “The vice president’s office asked a serious question. I was asked to help formulate the answer,” Wilson wrote in his now-infamous New York Times op-ed.
Thus, the defense of Wilson’s credibility boils down to skilled parsing: he didn’t say that Cheney’s office sent him, he only implied it. Sounds like the skillful semantic acrobatics to which Wilson’s defenders accuse Rove’s supporters.
Ok, let’s say-we give Wilson the benefit of the doubt. EVEN THEN, the career diplomat still has not been a pervayor of truth.
Just over a year ago, the husband of the CIA desk jockey, Valerie Plame, was exposed as an opportunist who lied at almost every turn in an audacious bid to grab his 15 minutes—and a seven-figure book deal.
He was outed not by Rove, the White House, or some right-wing outfit, but by the bipartisan Senate Select Intelligence Committee.
The bipartisan conclusion of the committee was that Wilson’s findings, if anything, served to support the belief that Saddam was actively seeking uranium for a nuclear program.
But Wilson revealed himself as the headline whore he is by grabbing the spotlight when the story first emerged about Niger and forged documents purporting to show illicit sales to Saddam. From the July 10, 2004 Washington Post:
He said then that he concluded the Niger intelligence was based on documents that had clearly been forged because “the dates were wrong and the names were wrong.”
“Committee staff asked how the former ambassador could have come to the conclusion that the ‘dates were wrong and the names were wrong’ when he had never seen the CIA reports and had no knowledge of what names and dates were in the reports,” the Senate panel said. Wilson told the panel he may have been confused and may have “misspoken” to reporters. The documents—purported sales agreements between Niger and Iraq—were not in U.S. hands until eight months after Wilson made his trip to Niger.
Obviously, Wilson’s apologists don’t much like the bipartisan report.
Macmind - Conservative Commentary and Common Sense linked with I too hope the Rove story continues - then we'll g
NIF linked with CEO-In-Training
July 22nd, 2005 at 10:28 am
And don’t forget that Wilson didn’t have any problems with Bush’s State of the Union speech until many months after — right after he joined the Kerry campaign.
July 22nd, 2005 at 4:07 pm
Cao, instead of cutting and pasting distortions and lies from Stev Horowitz’s rag, why don’t you go and read the original Washington Post article? You might notice if you go to it online the following correction:
In some editions of the Post, a July 10 story on a new Senate report on intelligence failures said that former ambassador Joseph C. Wilson IV told his contacts at the CIA that Iraq had tried to buy 400 tons of uranium from the African nation of Niger in 1998. In fact, it was Iran that was interested in making that purchase, but no contract was signed, according to the report.
In fact, the author of the article, Susan Schmidt, was only “cutting and pasting” what a WH staffer told her. Her article is full of distortions.
For example: Schmidt claims that the report states that the CIA “did not tell the White House it had qualms about the reliability of the Africa intelligence.” yet, on page 56 of the Senate Intel Report you find this passage:
Based on the analyst’s comments, the ADDI drafted a memo for the NSC outlining the facts that the CIA believed needed to be changed, and faxed it to the Deputy National Security Advisor and the speech writers. Referring to the sentence on uranium from Africa the CIA said, “remove the sentence because the amount is in dispute and it is debatable whether it can be acquired from the source. We told Congress that the Brits have exaggerated this issue.
But you wouldn’t know that would you? Because you haven’t even bothered to investigate any of this in detail. Your purpose, rather than to approach these matters with an open mind, is simply to cut and paste what your mind has already decided.
July 22nd, 2005 at 4:12 pm
Ogre, you’re full of ****. You know nothing about what Joe Wilson was doing in the aftermath of that flawed SOTU. The reason it took months for Wilson to respond publicly is because he tried to get the administration to correct itself privately. Wilson is a respectable man; he is also a very brave and distinguished public servant. As acting ambassador to Iraq in the run-up to the first Gulf War, he was the last US diplomat to meet with Saddam Hussein, in 1991. He very publicly defied the Iraqi strongman by giving refuge to more than 100 US citizens at the embassy and in the homes of US diplomats - at a time when Saddam Hussein was threatening to execute anyone who harboured foreigners.
He then addressed journalists wearing a hangman’s noose instead of a necktie.
He later told the Washington Post newspaper that the message to Saddam Hussein was: “If you want to execute me, I’ll bring my own [expletive] rope.”
You’re just joining in the Karl Rove smear campaign, throwing your own worthless mud because you have nothing better to do.
July 22nd, 2005 at 6:49 pm
Nit picking over the amount instead of the content, is that it? You’re a pretentious boob. Get off my blog. The language you’re using is not civilized. Go wash your mouth out with soap and get a clue.
It’s DAVID Horowitz, you idiot. Talk about people who can’t put together the details! I have put down more than just on this post–about this whole affair, there is more over at The Wide Awakes.
I don’t appreciate your accusatory tone, or the personal attack. That kind of behavior is not allowed here.
ok, let’s take a look at some of these telling details, shall we? In The Politics of Truth, Joseph Wilson writes that he and his future wife both returned from overseas assignments in June 1997. Neither Joe or Valerie was again stationed overseas. They appear to have remained in Washington, D.C., where they married and became parents of twins.
Six years later, in July 2003, the name of the CIA officer - Valerie Plame - was revealed by columnist Robert Novak.
The column’s date is important because the law against unmasking the identities of U.S. spies says a “covert agent” must have been on an overseas assignment “within the last five years.” The assignment also must be long-term, not a short trip or temporary post, (two experts on the law say). Wilson’s book makes numerous references to the couple’s life in Washington over the six years up to July 2003.
“Unless she was really stationed abroad sometime after their marriage,” she wasn’t a covert agent protected by the law, says Bruce Sanford, an attorney who helped write the 1982 act that protects covert agents’ identities.
It’s interesting that the democrats are willing to put all their faith in the CIA after they did such a bang-up job predicting 9/11. heh.
How dare Bush suggest Saddam was seeking uranium from Africa on the flimsy evidence of the findings of British intelligence, the findings of our own NIE, the fact that Israel blew up Saddam’s last nuclear reactor in 1981, Dr. Obeidi’s book “The Bomb in My Garden” which revealed there were tons of enriched uranium that was taken to a safer place and yellow cake, not to mention the fact that we learned about Saddam’s reconsitution of his nuke program only in 1996, when his son-in law briefly defected to Jordan (before he lured him back and had him murdered in front of everyone). The interesting thing is–it was Saddam’s son-in-law Hussein Kamel who “outed” Saddam for WMD. Hussein Kamel, headed Iraq’s nuclear, chemical, biological and missile programs for 10 years, told his story to the CIA, British Military Intelligence and UN inspectors. This naturally enraged Saddam Hussein, hence, Hussein Kamel died a public death by Saddam’s henchmen. (this is also in Obeidi’s book)
The Mr. Magoos from the UN Weapons Inspection Team had missed this fact that while scouring the country for five years after Gulf War I. Apparently it’s okay to get the facts wrong, but only in the service of slandering America–the country we’re supposed to believe liberals love.
July 22nd, 2005 at 7:34 pm
CEO-In-Training
Today’s dose of NIF - News, Interesting & Funny … Friday edition
July 22nd, 2005 at 7:45 pm
Ok, so if I’m incorrect, as you so eloquently describe it in your immature language, then let’s see what I could have wrong. I said that Wilson didn’t have any problems with Bush’s statements until months later. You claim I’m wrong. So, according to you, Wilson had a problem with Bush’s speech as soon as he said it. But apparently, you know Mr. Wilson so well that you personally know that he tried, apparently dozens and dozens of times, to contact Mr. Bush to get him to “correct” his speech.
And what do you have to back up your assertions? That Wilson met with Saddam. And he was so wonderful, he allowed American citizens to enter American soil (the embassy). Yes, that takes real balls to allow that. Oh, and Saddam “threatened” anyone who harbored foreigners with death? Sure, that’s a real valid threat. Gee, Saddam, how’d those threats against the United States go?
So in other words, I said that Wilson didn’t have any problems with Bush until he joined Kerry’s campaign. But you instead claim that he did, he just never said anything about it until one day he decided he’d had enough — and that just happened to be when he joined the Kerry campaign.
Sorry the fact conflict with your world. That’s the annoying thing about facts — they don’t mold and change depending on your personal whims. Should we even talk about the fact that Mr. Wilson’s own reports to the Senate Intelligence committee supported Bush’s State of the Union speech? No, that’s another fact that would conflict with your reality, wouldn’t it?
Brad, have fun in your own personally constructed fantasy-land. Even call it “reality-based,” if you like. I can call the moon green cheese, but it doesn’t make it so. Perhaps one day you will join us in the real world. We’ll be here, waiting for you to understand real life. Until then, we’ll also continue to protect you from terrorists and REAL dangers, while you likely continue to deny them.
July 22nd, 2005 at 8:10 pm
A fool finds no pleasure in understanding but delights in airing his own opinions.
July 22nd, 2005 at 8:15 pm
“However big the fool, there is always a bigger fool to admire him.”
July 23rd, 2005 at 9:52 am
I too hope the Rove story continues - then we’ll g
David Limbaugh shares my opinion on this whole Plame Game ‘leak” fraud. Rove didn’t do anything but protect the President and our nation from a rogue CIA agent and her politically biased husband.
I also agree that bloggers, especially conservati…
July 23rd, 2005 at 11:05 am
The language you’re using is not civilized. Go wash your mouth out with soap and get a clue.
Apparently it’s OK for your buddies like SSGt Yatahey to tell me to Shut the **** up
and call me a “peter-puffing Numbnuts Communist,” but not OK for me to use any language fouler than “aw shucks.”
It’s DAVID Horowitz, you idiot
Thanks for pointing out the oversight. And by the way, the “communist safe haven for radicals” is BERKELEY, you idiot.
I don’t appreciate your accusatory tone, or the personal attack. That kind of behavior is not allowed here.
But personal attacks on “traitors” like John Kerry are perfectly acceptable? I guess it is your blog, so you get to break your own rules and think nothing of it.
July 23rd, 2005 at 11:06 am
You think you know all about the Intelligence Identities Protection Act of 1982, just because you cut and pasted a quote from some attorney? Has it occurred to you at all to wonder why, if Bruce Sanford and all your Wingnut bloggers seem to think she isn’t a covert agent protected by the law, that Patrick Fitzgerald (appointed not by Democrats, by the way) is even bothering to conduct such an exhaustive investigation? If no laws were broken, why is there a grand jury? Why have reporters been threatened with jail time?
Did you even bother to read Obeidi’s book? I’ll bet you didn’t. And you wouldn’t know that Obeidi has written:
So, how could the West have made such a mistaken assessment of the nuclear program before the invasion last year? Even to those of us who knew better, it’s fairly easy to see how observers got the wrong impression. First, there was Saddam Hussein’s history. He had demonstrated his desire for nuclear weapons since the late 1970’s, when Iraqi scientists began making progress on a nuclear reactor. He had used chemical weapons against his own people and against Iran during the 1980’s. After the 1991 war, he had tried to hide his programs in weapons of mass destruction for as long as possible (he even kept my identity secret from weapons inspectors until 1995). It would have been hard not to suspect him of trying to develop such weapons again….In addition, the West never understood the delusional nature of Saddam Hussein’s mind. By 2002, when the United States and Britain were threatening war, he had lost touch with the reality of his diminished military might. By that time I had been promoted to director of projects for the country’s entire military-industrial complex, and I witnessed firsthand the fantasy world in which he was living. He backed mythic but hopeless projects like one for a long-range missile that was completely unrealistic considering the constraints of international sanctions. The director of another struggling missile project, when called upon to give a progress report, recited a poem in the dictator’s honor instead. Not only did he not go to prison, Saddam Hussein applauded him
No, you wouldn’t know that. You couldn’t read such a passage and glean any real understanding of what he’s getting at. Your simple fool’s mind is already made up.
July 23rd, 2005 at 11:08 am
I have Obeidi’s book sitting right here, you moron. I’m sick of your insults and your condescension..not to mention your total disrespect and your potty mouth. You should really pick up the book “how to win friends and influence people”. Because the approach you’re taking is such that I’m shutting you up here. I’ve quoted from Obeidi’s book, in fact, in previous posts. You’re a complete ***, devoid of any civilized manners. You are now officially banned. Future linkage is denied. I will not tolerate your imbecilic trolling, your insults, and whatever else you’ve got. You have your own blog, go ***** and moan, cry and complain from over there.
What I learned from Obeidi’s book was…he turned the components for the gas centrifuge to product enriched uranium for Saddam’s nukes over to the Americans along with the blueprints/plans. And the plans for this centrifuge were not turned over to the US until the war had begun. That wouldn’t have happened if we hadn’t gone there. And who do you supposed would have wound up with all of that if we hadn’t? The program could have been started up instantly with just a snap of Saddam’s fingers. He had put it on “hold”…he hadn’t “abandoned” in altogether. He was performing a sleight of hand…and he did a major shell game to hide what he had. What we discovered was what he had was broken down and sent all over the world to other countries…some things, like missiles, for example, still had the UN weapons inspection tags on them.
In addition, we needed to help the scientists find employment in areas other than developing nuclear weapons. So I hope you’re catching my drift here. (Well now that you’re banned, probably not :twisted:)
The stuff that’s sitting in the Bakaa Valley is in terrorist hands, he paid the Syrians over $35 million to bury the stuff there. That didn’t happen until we were at the border in Kuwait.
And interestingly, there were a lot of barrels of “pesticides” that were buried in underground bunkers–weapons bunkers…and our soldiers and Iraqis suffered symptoms of biological weapons from those “harmless pesticides”…
Sorry…I just don’t swallow any of this. Joe Wilson’s story “What I didn’t Find in Africa” doesn’t jibe with the official report. Saddam sure as hell did try to secure uranium from Niger…Niger’s only exports are uranium ore 65%, livestock products, cowpeas, onions (1998 est.) You can’t tell me that Saddam’s people went over there to secretly negotiate for cowpeas.
Bush’s infamous 16 words didn’t say Saddam procured the uranium, those 16 words were that Saddam had TRIED–that he sent people over there to TRY. Fact is, we air lifted enriched uranium out of Iraq, so he DID manage to get it from SOMEWHERE. Sitting on our hands waiting for them to drop the bomb was not the right thing to do.
Guess what? Joe Wilson’s full of hot air. But most of us with a few more than TWO BRAIN CELLS already figured that out.
July 23rd, 2005 at 2:52 pm
Poor little Braddie “BOY” — let me tell you something, Twinkle-toed Camel-licking ****-less Brains … if you have a problem with how I address your ignorant statements, DON’T take it out on Cao or any other person here!
YOU LITTLE ****-SUCKING GRABASSTIC, DIS-ORGANIZED MORONIC WEASEL … GET YOUR HEAD OUT OF YOUR *** AND DEAL WITH IT BEFORE I MAKE YOU MY OWN PERSONAL PIN CUSHION!!!
YEAH, I KNOW WHAT YOU ARE THINKING … YOU’RE AFRAID, THINKING THAT I HAVE SUCH AN “EXTREME” ATTITUDE AND THAT I NEED TO BE MORE “SENSITIVE” TO OTHER PEOPLE’S FEELINGS.
WELL LET ME TELL YOU SOMETHING YOU POLE-SMOKING PANSY!
DID YOU HAVE A BIG BOWL OF STUPID FOR BREAKFAST THIS MORNING, NUMBNUTS?
I DON’T WANT TO HEAR ANOTHER WORD OUT OF THAT COMMUNIST-LOVING CRY-HOLE IN THAT ****-PILE YOU CALL A HEAD!
NOW GET THE HELL OFF OF OUR PLANET BEFORE I SHOVE MY BOOT SO FAR UP YOUR *** THAT YOU CHOKE TO DEATH ON MY SHOELACES!!!!”
YOUR LITTLE RACK-BUDDY, JOHN “HANOI FONDA” SKERRY IS A LYING JACK-*** AND NEEDS TO STAND UP LIKE A MAN AND TAKE THE HEAT FOR LYING TO PEOPLE … END OF STORY!
July 23rd, 2005 at 5:24 pm
um …SSGT, he’s talking about Joe Wilson here–not John Fonda Skerry…
July 23rd, 2005 at 6:18 pm
Okay, Cao — perhaps I stand corrected; I was going by his statement:
But personal attacks on “traitors” like John Kerry are perfectly acceptable?”
July 24th, 2005 at 5:03 am
heh. I didn’t get that. I didn’t read his rant, to be perfectly honest…after a few sentences of insults. “personal attack on John Kerry”? The guy is not making good on his promises and he’s been a Senator for 20 years. Why isn’t it appropriate to shed light on the fact? I’m not saying a thing about the guy that isn’t true or part of the public record…
Kerry promised the American people on public television to release his records. What he released was the same thing we’ve already seen. There are over 130 pages missing. How is that a “personal attack on John Kerry”? Geez. This guy Brad needs a reality check. Now he has taken his personal attack on me to email.
July 24th, 2005 at 6:05 am
Taken his personal attack on you to email?:evil:
Well; you know what to do with that!:lol:
Too bad he doesn’t email me; he’d have somewhat of a surprise coming…
Over 130 pages missing from a ****-sandwich of a Senator, who has a wet-dream of becoming President, is NOT acceptable … he needs to come clean, or the citizens of Mass. need to remove him from Office permanently, and stop paying him so damn much to only show up for “work” once every 3 months.
I can only imagine how often the little weasel would show up in the Oval *******!:twisted:
July 24th, 2005 at 7:16 am
That is my hope, SSGT…all we’re looking for is for the Senator to tell the truth and quit throwing the spotlight on others. He’s calling for the new Supreme Court nominee to release his records.
I say…John O’Neill and John Roberts to release their records.
I think any dialogue with Kerry should stop until he follows through on his promise to the American people–that he’d “clear up” the questions remaining.
But I doubt it will happen, I’m just pointing out that to my way of thinking he’s a hypocrite by demanding of others what he himself is not willing to do.