I am sad about what’s been happening in New Orleans, but I’m even more sad about how these people with Bush Derangement Syndrome are treating the president and whining that the federal government should be taking care of them.
Since when is it government’s responsibility to take care of people?
I’m also amazed at the rhetoric coming out of Kanye West; that “Bush doesn’t care about black people”.
Liberals are stuck in the past. On the economy, they’re stuck in the 1930′s. On civil rights, they’re stuck in the late 1800-s to the 1960′s. On war, they’re stuck in the Vietnam era. To even imagine for one second that they’re REALLY “progressive” as they say, is a far stretch of the imagination.
To liberals, we are a “racist” society and they see everything through this little myopic window of “racism”. This is why we hear the wailing about all the black people in New Orleans who are suffering. These people are part of the welfare mindset who expect government to take care of their every need.
What is lost in this myopic picture is that there are people of all races and creeds and socioeconomic backgrounds who were affected by this. God and George Bush didn’t single out poor people or black people –they were given sufficient warning and decided to do nothing. Oh, perhaps they didn’t have cars to get outta dodge….there are veterans down there who are suffering, and Heidi from Euphoric Reality is down there helping them.
Who’s preventing poor people from bettering their lives? Is it Bush? Aren’t these choices that people consciously make?
The president said the results were not sufficient, he wasn’t admitting guilt. I have actually heard people say that George Bush admitted guilt for this situation, because they expect him to. When he stood in front of the American people and said what government is doing, the hand wringers were upset with him because he didn’t cry on camera. For heaven’s sake, what is wrong with you people? You listen to the same news reports, but you skew it because of your Bush Derangement Syndrome.
I’ve heard that people want a price freeze on gasoline. Now if that isn’t stupid. This is a free market. When supply goes down, prices go up; that’s Economics 101, people!
President Bush stated that the response was appropriate, but the results have been unacceptable.
Like the pictures of the buses in water show, the mayor should have been more proactive in getting people out of there. When you have a mass evac, you open both sides of the interstate going out of the city that will most certainly be flooded. Didn’t happen.
And the President understands that it is the state’s job to promote the health and safety of its citizens, and the Federal Government will come in when needed. And, they are there.
The entire gulf coast area was declared a disaster area on Saturday before the storm hit–by The President. Why? So the Major and Governor, both Democrats, could utilize all of the resources of FEMA and get people to safety.
In their infinite wisdom, the Mayor and the Governor of Louisiana chose to shut down resources early on Sunday. Finally they got around to making a plea for people to leave New Orleans, less then 24 hours before the storm was going to hit the city.
In fact the Mayor almost did not to order the evacuation because he had to check with his lawyers.
Nagin said late Saturday that he’s having his legal staff look into whether he can order a mandatory evacuation of the city, a step he’s been hesitant to do because of potential liability on the part of the city for closing hotels and other businesses. Source
Whose poor planning and terrible response time was it? It was local and state officials who dropped the ball. They did not even follow their evacuation plan, as reported by many news outlets. If you really have to blame someone, look no further them the Mayor of New Orleans and the Governor of Louisiana.
When you consider all those buses–not even used…then the question becomes–Did someone have to buy, rent or steal a vehicle to get outta dodge, or did someone just have to round up some bus drivers? I heard that a man who took matters in his own hands and rescued people by commandeering a bus could get in trouble for having done so. So is that what people are waiting for in this litigious society–permission from the powers that be so they won’t get sued?
Hello…the State of Louisiana is responsible for its citizens, just like every other state in the union. Do you recall that we fought a civil war over state’s rights?
The federal government’s purpose is not to babysit every citizen. The people in this country used to be self-sufficient and took pride in that fact. Now everyone walks around crying about what the government owes them.
The mismanagement of the city of New Orleans over the last 50 years is the greatest factor in the poverty, crime, and corruption that its citizens have to deal with on a daily basis.
Are you familiar with the corruption of Huey Long?
On the one hand, you can sit there and look for someone to blame the deaths of many innocents in New Orleans on, or you can focus on how to help the people who are still alive. There will be plenty of time for people like to make accusations.
Find some way to help or shut up. Complaining does absolutely no good right now.
Cao, my only question is – if the government isn’t responsible for helping out in these type of emergencies, then why are they helping out now? Why did they help out the Asians in the Tsunami? Why did our Federal Government help out with 9-11?
If that is what the Republicans/Conservatives stand for, then why don’t they stand by their word instead of giving into our pleas for help?
What I’m trying to say is–the biggest complainers are the people who aren’t doing anything to help, for one thing. And the people who aren’t helping themselves.
People have complained about the national guard being authorized to shoot. In New Orleans, “law and order” is a code word for “racism”. So when people went in there to help, they were being shot at by criminals who had been looting and–women are getting raped down there. It’s a horrible situation. But it’s not just government that is responsible. People are perfectly able to fend for themselves–except for children and the elderly.
For another thing, local government and the state government (the Mayor and the Governor) were at fault for not taking action sooner. Look below at the post with the picture of the buses in it. I thought I put that down very clearly ON TWO SEPARATE POSTS.
Conservatives are all about PERSONAL RESPONSIBILITY–not the welfare state. We’ve got too many generations of people who aren’t even capable of thinking for themselves, it seems. Then we have guys like that Kanye West who are saying things like “Bush doesn’t care about black people”. It’s ridiculous. People of all religions, races and creeds are down there helping…Mother Nature didn’t single out ‘black people’ when the hurricane came through, as a matter of fact, those people could have left on their own accord. But they chose not to.
And that’s someone else’s fault, apparently, according to leftists.
If that’s not what it’s intented for? If you say that, then our government is not sticking to their guns. Do you see what I’m saying here?
Please don’t get me wrong. I’m open to the fact that there just may be some things I don’t understand. If that be the case, then please give me some heads up here.
Oops, looks like we were posting at the same time.
TBug: I am curious about your question. When you refer to government, are you making any distinction between local, state, and federal? I’m asking because the 10th Amendment makes that distinction.
The best work that a government can do for its people is to “prevent” such disasters. For the past 30 years, the Congress has continuously cut funding for the Army Corps of Engineers. Both political parties are responsible for this.
We should ask, “What steps did the city and parish of New Orleans take in anticipation of such an event (given location). What steps did the soverign state of Louisiana take?
Of course, when local and state governments are corrupt, I suppose you can always anticipate a debacle like the devastation wrought by Katrina.
My point about big government is–In the 20 years since the Reagan revolution began, the federal budget has almost quadrupled. Even adjusting for inflation, the federal enterprise is twice as large as it was in 1980.
Today, approximately one million more Americans work for the government than for manufacturers – and the government doesn’t produce anything!
When our Founding Fathers set up our government, they envisioned a national government with limited power and responsibility. Those responsibilities were outlined in Article I, Section 8 of our Constitution: national defense, a court system, roads, post office and the ability to repay debt that might occur due to war. THAT’S IT!
National defense is by far the most important function of our federal government. In 1800, defense constituted more than half of total federal outlays. Today the defense of this country receives barely 1/6 of federal outlays, while social welfare transfer payments soak up almost 40%.
I believe in personal responsibility too in the sense that I don’t think the government should be responsible to help those who do nothing to help themselves because they’d rather get a “free ride” instead of working.
There are poor people that work too, though – just doing the best they can.
Cao, I think some rather than being too stubborn to evacuate, that they just couldn’t due to the traffic being backed up, lack of transportation, hotels booked solid, couldn’t afford transportation, or decided to stay home instead of getting stuck in their car for fear of getting caught in 8ft of water in the middle of nowhere.
I am not sure any of us really now how much ahead of time they were given the mandatory warning to evacuate. None of us were there and don’t really know what was going on.
Even those that DID evacuate needed so much help that they didn’t get soon enough. But you’re right. It is not Bush’s fault that there were people taking shots at the relief squad upon arrival. I don’t think anyone of us were expecting that.
My only problem with all this is that help didn’t come soon enough and in large enough amounts. So, I guess we can blame the following:
–the local and state government
–and those that were shooting at helicopters
Are you all just saying that the Federal Government shouldn’t be blamed. Aren’t the feds in there now?
I have an open mind. Educate me! I’ve heard the Left. I want to hear more from the Right now.
The entire gulf coast area was declared a disaster area on Saturday before the storm hit–by The President. Why? So the Mayor and the Governor, both Democrats, could utilize all of the resources of FEMA and get people to safety.
In their infinite wisdom, the Mayor and the Governor of Louisiana chose to shut down resources early on Sunday. Finally they got around to making a plea for people to leave New Orleans, less then 24 hours before the storm was going to hit the city.
In fact the Mayor almost did not order the evacuation because he had to check with his lawyers.
If you read this article, you can tell just by reading-that the storm hit on Monday –that in Mississippi, for example, 50 of the dead were from an apartment complex near the beach at a resort. Some of these reports show that the people didn’t realize what they were in for–and weren’t prepared for it. I have no idea what kind of warning they were given, but I know that it wasn’t given on Saturday…when the President declared it a disaster area.
Granted, I’m relying on news sources, although Heidi, Kit’s co-blogger at Euphoric Reality is actually down there at the Astrodome right now. The Mad Tech from Ravings of a Mad Tech has signed up to go down there with FEMA to help. He’s planning to leave his family to go down there to pitch in where he can, for as long as he’s needed.
Thanks for this information. I’ve never been so torn between the Left and the Right before like this, and that’s just because of lack of knowledge on my part.
What I’m going to do with your info, I don’t know, but it’s good to hear what both sides have to say.
You’re right on the money, Conservative Goddess. I wrote about kind of the same thing today. As Americans, we have a duty to do what’s right, and quit complaining for the sake of complaining.
Putting all these debates to side, it really touches me something awful to see people physically go down there and help out.
My husband and I have both donated, but that’s all we’re able to do.
Cao… I think you have taken the right path here. I have been racking my brain to find it, but I remember seeing a report last Sunday that New Orleans had been missed by the brunt of Katrina and if you notice, New Orleans has minimal damage from wind compared with Gulf Port and Biloxi. A few levees then broke and that is why New Orleans has suffered. A rush of flooding waters is what drowned people.
This morning on CNN a general had indicated that Katrina was in fact two disasters, one with wind damage and one with flood damage. This same general indicated that as of Thursday, water was still rising. Sending troops in for a rescue would be pointless because they would in fact be in danger with the waters still rising.
Some libs are making me sick to see what they are spewing out. I even have seen posts that are asking for Bush’s head!! Sorry, but when election time comes, these statements by the libs are going to come back and bite them. If they used their energy for good instead of evil it would make a big difference right now. This is a very scary time…
Ok, I guess all these people who are homeless, have no way to get to money in a bank, all the stores have been leveled, have no way out, should do what to help themselves? They have to depend on the government right now.
Not all people are shooting at helicopters and stealing tv’s, it is a small fraction of people doing that, and things like this bring out the best or the worst in people.
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“I am not sure any of us really now how much ahead of time they were given the mandatory warning to evacuate. None of us were there and don’t really know what was going on.”
“My only problem with all this is that help didn’t come soon enough and in large enough amounts.”
Oh, c’mon T-Bug — surely you aren’t that damn brain-dead, are you? Good gawd, woman — THE WHOLE DAMN COUNTRY SAW THE STORM COMING IN FOR DAYS — so, don’t play stupid with such an ignorant statement; hell — I’m in SW Arizona and watched it moving in for days!
Obviously, you’ve never been thru a major Hurricane — so; pay close attention Dumbass — THERE WAS PLENTY OF HELP JUST OUTSIDE THE AREA IMMEDIATLY AFTERWARD — THEY JUST COULD NOT DRIVE BUSES AND TRUCKS THRU TWENTY (20) FEET OF STANDING WATER!!!
What part of that do all of you Leftie-Communist-Lovers NOT FULLY UNDERSTAND???
I have PERSONALLY GONE THRU FOURTEEN (14) HURRICANES SINCE I’M ORIGINALLY FROM SOUTH TEXAS — where the hell were you and the other DEMOSHITTER MORONS when Hurricane Carla slammed into Corpus Christi, TX (my hometown) with WINDS IN “EXCESS OF 200 MPH”???
And, as for that “Cindy” — you’re another brain-dead, Leftie-Communist-Lover … how large of a bowl of LEFTIE STUPID DUMBASS did you eat for breakfast???
TBug: My heart aches when I see the suffering of the people who were left in a lurch by the city, parish, and state. But I feel reinforced when I see the work done now to save them, orchestrated by the federal government. There will be plenty of time for pointing fingers later on, so right now we have to concentrate on helping those who need it.
But you are so right that “most people” were not rioting, looting, and raping. Most people are simply victims. But I feel that they are victims for two essential reasons. (1) They are living in, and have particpated in, one of the most corrupt systems of local government in the entire USA. (2) They have been taught for the past 60 years that “government” will take care of everything. They have lost that uniquely American spirit of self reliance. For example, I personally would NOT be waiting for some one to come and save me and my family. That is MY responsibility, insofar as I can do it.
My concern is this: if a disaster of this nature can paralyze an entire region of the US (given the mind set of our citizens), are we in danger of similar problems resulting from other than natural disasters? We cannot allow our society to fall apart if a bunch of idiots set off a dirty bomb in one of our larger cities. But I think that the degree to which we can survive any disaster depends on electing responsible officials (not corrupt ones). NYC on 9/11 is an interesting contrast to that of NOLA a scant four years later.
Thank you for an enjoyable dialogue.
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For crying out loud, people were hit by Katrina in Florida on August 25th, click here. By then it was a category 3 storm. This is a satellite image of the storm from August 24. So as early as August 25th people knew that this thing was on its way and what its projected path was, including satellite images. The Tsunami victims had no such warning.
People have compared what happened with Katrina with the Tsunami in Asia and there is one huge difference. The people didn’t see it coming in Asia. Apparently there–they don’t have satellite imaging. They don’t have weather men giving you a forcast every day. Although I gather we are throwing money at that problem, too.
Interesting…I don’t see any of these socialist/communist countries coming in to help us with the aftermath of Katrina like we did after the Tsunami. Why do you suppose that is? We’re expected to “take care of the world” even if they’re muslims who wear bin Laden t-shirts and hate America as in the case of the majority of the Tsunami victims. But hey. When something happens to us, we’re just left alone to fend for ourselves. That in itself pisses me off. Why the hell should we help all these socialist/communist countries that starve their own people and whose government are so corrupt that whatever we do to help (like the Oil for Food program, for example)–never gets to the people for which it’s intended?
As Yat says, people were watching that storm move for DAYS before it hit. If you knew a Category 5 or 4 Hurricane was headed your way and you were in its direct path, wouldn’t you do something to protect yourself and your family?
This news report is from August 27. Katrina, the second hurricane to hit Florida this year, grew from a disorganized 50-mph tropical storm to one with 92-mph wind gusts in a few hours Thursday.
Look at this satellite image and read the commentary from August 28. People were talking about the conditions with the levies even before the storm struck; the situation with the Army of Corps of Engineers that Mustang pointed out, etc..
This is not the same as the Tsunami. The Tsunami blind-sided a bunch of innocent people. Katrina came barreling through and people KNEW ABOUT IT. People KNEW IT WAS COMING. Sometimes I think God sends these things through to clean the gene pool. Have you ever read the Darwin awards? Where people are killed doing absolutely stupid things? Sitting in the path of a Category 4 Hurricane and doing nothing about it when you know it’s on its way is plain stupid in my opinion. If your life depended on leaving town, you’d find a way to do it. “No money”, “no car”, etc., are just not good enough excuses for me. But then…I believe in personal responsibility.
“…grew from a disorganized 50-mph tropical storm to one with 92-mph wind gusts in a few hours Thursday.”
Precisely, Cao — and, just like people who live in “Tornado Alley”, likewise the people who live in “Hurricane Alley” constantly watch; listen to; and/or read the news concerning Tropical systems, as they can gather so much strength in a matter of a few hours.
Many of the Leftists have it lodged in their “brain cell” that it takes a long time to get ready to leave before a storm hits — obviously, they’re thinking they need to get a Tractor-Trailer rig in there; load up an entire house; move halfway across the country; buy a new house; and set it up all over again.
After you’ve lived down there, even for just one season, you’ve been told by long-time residents to keep a “Hurricane Bag” ready BEFORE THE SEASON STARTS which only includes “absolutely necessary items”, such as insurance papers; medical records; etc.
Then, if and when you’re leaving, throw your Bag and clothes into the car; get your car gassed up; and leave the area — sometimes, it can be a false alarm — but, my attitude was always, “Better safe than sorry”; and I did leave several times due to the magnitude of the storm.
Yatehey, obviously you didn’t read what I wrote or you wouldn’t be responding that way. I was merely asking Cao questions. Cao, along with other conservatives here, were informing me of the process of which I wasn’t aware of. I am not one of those people blaming Bush.
For more information on my political profile, you are welcome to my blog to see. You’d be quite surprised to see where I stand.
Cao was very civil with me, and so were many other conervatives in and outside her blog. Your response was unnessary and ignorant as to where I really stand.
As for me being a commie? That’s the funniest thing I’ve heard since the Micheal Jackson jokes on Jay Leno. I am very capitalistic and support capitalism. Both my husband and I work very hard and fend for ourselves without looking for handouts for the government.
I saw what was happening in the news too and heard too that Katrina was coming for days, but that was because
1. I had electricity.
2. If I were living there, I would have had the money and means to evacuate.
3. I don’t have a physical disability that keeps me from evacuating my home.
4. I can afford to evacuate 3-6 times a year everytime I hear a hurricane is coming.
I’m a Florida born citizen and have lived through one false alarm after another. Some of those living in New Orleans did not have the money to “pick up and go” upon every “There’s another hurrican commin’” piece of news.
So before you get on your commie-crackin’ bandwagin and start presuming things about me that you don’t know, read the entirety of what I wrote here. If you had followed my post all the way down, you would have also been aware of when I wrote this just up above:
Thank God, not all Repubs are not like you.
Since when is it government’s responsibility to take care of people?
I fully agree. The Bush administration was just funnin’ around when they accepted and supposedly implemented the National Response Plan in December 2004., in which they stated that it is in fact a Federal responsibility to take care of American citizens affected by disasters on American soil:
Why on earth anyone in New Orleans expected the Federal government to save their life is completely beyond me.
That doesn’t mean you sit there while the storm is coming with your thumbs up your ***. C’mon. Use some common sense.
Oh I forgot…libs don’t have any.
There are a few exceptions, like Ticklebug. I don’t agree with the welfare state, and government is way too big. I believe in limited government and there’s way too much “entitlement” thinking out there as a result of big government policies. People who ignorantly say that I’m a “neocon” aren’t reading what I’m writing and are assuming way too much about “conservative rednecks”.
What liberals don’t seem to understand is–we republicans or conservatives actually think for ourselves. We don’t agree on all issues. We don’t sound like so many on the left who repeat little slogans and don’t think about the consequences of what they’re saying. We actually have an understanding of the world around us…and we even debate each other on certain issues. This isn’t easy to understand by someone that–as Jay points out–is accepting marching orders from the Daily Kos.
Ticklebug, on the other hand, seems to understand where I’m coming from, and there are a few others. As for idiots like you, you’re off the mark.
I’m not marching lockstep with ‘a proud tradition of growing government at a slower rate’. I think we should slash and burn a lot of what we’re throwing money at that doesn’t work. What’s ridiculous is throwing more money at a system that’s proven time and again to be inefficient and a waste of taxpayers’ dollars. You can look at any of the social programs and see they don’t work–we have generations of people who have forgotten how to take care of themselves. This is my biggest issue.
Now they’re talking about taking FEMA out of the Department of Homeland Security. There are so many branches with so many rules and regs it’s impossible to follow it all. And as I’ve mentioned before, government is a monolith as compared to what it was only 20 years ago. I don’t agree with it, and I’ve been writing my senators and congressmen–I haven’t been sitting there idly watching it grow–I’ve been fighting its growth.
There are people who are calling for Michael Brown’s firing because of what they call “FEMA’s” slow response time. They’re calling for an investigation as to why it took so long to respond…still looking for someone to blame.
I think a place we can start with is Mother Nature.
Government mishandles our money, is inefficient, and growing it is only going to make matters worse. Throwing more money at it is insane.
Here is how the far left plan to help.
Brad – I concur with what Cao said; obviously, you’re another one of those Leftie-Communist Dickheads who’s never been thru something like this, and you don’t have a clue about anything … now; finish that extra-large bowl of YANKEE STUPIDITY this morning, and get off your whining Lib-***; go down to N.O. and help Jesse JackAss ***** about **** neither of you Twinkle-toed Communists know anything about.
This isn’t easy to understand by someone that–as Jay points out–is accepting marching orders from the Daily Kos.
You find the facts I posted inconvenient. Therefore I am not able to think for myself. Brilliant logic.
…you’re another one of those Leftie-Communist Dickheads
You find the facts I posted inconvenient. Therefore I am a Communist. Brilliant logic.
Was the Federal Government by its own statements obliged to respond quickly and effectively to prevent loss of life in New Orleans? And did it do so?
The facts I posted, you ignored. So who’s finding facts inconvenient?
What I said was–and I’ll repeat it since you ignored it–
The National Response Plan does not usurp an individual’s responsibility for himself. It doesn’t give anyone the right or the excuse to sit waiting for a disaster to happen with his thumbs up his ***.
Now, there are a lot of Right-Winged people helping out in N.O. whether people were too dumb to evacuate or not.
So, evidently the “you must take responsibility for yourself” way of thinking is on the back burner because these people are more concerned about helping.
The amount of help needed is so overwhelming for everybody. For the sake of arguement, lets just say that we leave “the idiots” on the rooftops and all those that “refused” to evacute to die. OK. Fine.
We’ve got thousands upon thousands the DID make it to the Superdome who needed help and were “smart enough to get there”. SSgt Yatahey, are you saying that you’d leave grandma in a wheelchair without her Diabetes meds, a few weeks old baby sitting wallowing in his own feces and urine, and all the others starving dying of thirst to sit and rot because they need not rely on anyone to help them. Maybe I’m misunderstanding you, but if I’m not — that mindset is pretty absurd.
And I don’t know where “Communism” enters this picture. This is a bipartisan disaster; not one that just happened to Liberals or people that don’t work very hard for a living and had always carried on their lives being dependant on no one.
Have any of you read what Ken wrote in Oblogatory Anecdotes? This was a real eye opener for me.
I still don’t understand why FEMA is there, why the communication lines were destroyed, and why they kept turning back? Was this due to the snipers?
Cao, thanks for the compliment. As you can see, I’m starting to understand this a little better, however, the more I read on this, the more confusing it can get.
By the way, outside of Oblogatory Anecdots’s blog, I found another well written conservative blog out there that I thought ya’ll need to read (especially SSgt Yatahey)
I paid very close attention to what you said, Cao. You said:
Since when is it government’s responsibility to take care of people?
And I pointed out that the Federal Government itself took responsibility for “taking care of people”, in the National Response Plan. That’s a fact, Cao — one which you seem fully willing to ignore, for the sake of blaming the victims.
I’ll ask again, since you may have missed it the first time: Was the Federal Government by its own statements obliged to respond quickly and effectively to prevent loss of life in New Orleans? And did it do so?
Did the mayor? Did the Governor of Louisiana appropriately respond by giving their citizens less than 24 hours warning or notice? (Just about not giving their citizens ANY WARNING AT ALL because they had to check with their lawyers?) Did the government by slashing the Army Corps of Engineers who’s been recommending for a long time to repair and update those levies?
This is a clear example of what the age-old corruption in Louisiana politics has done for the people in Louisiana. The fact that they created a problem on a bunch of fronts that is now the Federal Government’s ballywick is disgusting. That means the rest of the nation will have to help in the cleanup. Now I can’t talk about Mississippi or Florida, but I don’t hear the same complaints coming out of those places; or a high death rate of people who didn’t evacuate when told to do so.
As Yat pointed out, how could it possibly have done so with 20 feet of standing water in the way? You’re still not being very reasonable.
“This was not just a hurricane; it was a hurricane that was followed by a flood,” Chertoff told CNN’s “Late Edition.”
“It was unprecedented and, I think, that created a challenge that, frankly, overwhelmed a lot of people — state and local folks. We had people on the ground who were pre-positioned,” he said, citing 50 Coast Guard helicopters as an example.
Chertoff said federal authorities “moved as rapidly as we could,” and added that he, too, was frustrated that the pace of the response was not quicker.
“The fact of the matter is: It’s never enough when there are still people suffering,” he said.
“But there’s also a tremendous amount of credit to be given,” he said, pointing to the Coast Guard, FEMA, state and local rescue workers, the National Guard and the military.
With all the failures of government bureacracy and politicking in mind…Nothing can take the place of personal individual responsibility, I don’t care what kind of bureacracy was set up to handle emergencies. To relieve people of responsibility for their own safety is simply ridiculous.
That’s what you’re missing…the element of common sense that everyone should have when facing a disaster.
Government didn’t say…don’t do anything we’ll take care of you–they just set up a plan in the event of a disaster. What about that is so difficult to understand?
I also said–making government bigger is a mistake since it’s throwing the baby out with the bathwater. Government bureacracy will never take the place of a man looking out for his family or just a person watching out for Number 1.
And I’m sorry if you can’t connect with that rationale. Government does not take personal responsibility for an individual. It is up to that person. And if they decided to sit on their hands and wait for the government to rescue them, they’re going to wait a long time.
Government is inefficient and a waste of our money. We should cut it down to size and get back to the original intent of our forefathers.
Still blaming the victims. *sigh* … I get it now.
I note that you were extremely careful to ignore the first question: Was the Federal Government by its own statements obliged to respond quickly and effectively to prevent loss of life in New Orleans? It must cause you tremendous agony to see that question asked again.
I do hope you’ll remember your harsh words for the dead of New Orleans — and that you will take a public vow, right here and now, that you will never ever call upon your local police and fire departments to help you in an emergency. After all, government is inefficient and a waste of our money. If you’re stupid enough to sit around with your thumb up your *** while your house is burgled, or while it is burning down, it’s your own damn fault. That was the clear intention of the Founding Fathers.
They’re only victims of their own stupidity, Bradley. *smiling* Just like you. I already answered your question, above. The fact that you keep beating me with the same question indicates to me that you’re not getting the answer you want to hear (or you’re devastatingly stupid). I’m so sorry that you can’t accept that I 1) don’t agree with you and 2) don’t believe that it’s government’s responsibility.
I pointed out there are a lot of other elements having to do with this other than the Federal Government. The levies, the Army Corps of Engineers, the Governor of Louisiana, the Mayor, corruption in Louisiana government, ad infinitum.
You’re the one who seems to be in agony since you’re so clueless you keep beating your head against the wall,
And since your IP address says you’re in Amsterdam, what the hell do you know about it? If you’re an American citizen, what have you done from there to help the people in New Orleans or elsewhere that you’re defending for doing nothing when this storm was approaching?
Insanity is also a trademark of your way of thinking; doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results.
Sometimes people are victims because they chose to be. People like you aren’t helping them take responsibility; and frankly I don’t have much sympathy for someone who–as Yat pointed out with his post about living in Tornado alley and having an escape route and a bag packed…CHOSE TO DO NOTHING.
Not facing reality is something that you people defend. I don’t.
I have given to the relief efforts, and I’m watching the news and my heart bleeds for these people–but I’m not a bleeding heart liberal that cries for social injustice when there isn’t any. Clinton said, lol–there will probably be an investigation into this–some kind of Commission (like the 9/11 Commission–can anybody say ABLE DANGER), so you can rely upon government coming up with more recommendations to grow government bigger now…that’s always their solution…not matter WHAT the facts are.
But it won’t make things more efficient, and it won’t save lives.
Bradley, I’ll make this simple for you. From me to you… no charge! 1. The government has responsibility to it’s citizens, the citizens in turn have a responsibility to the government and part of that responsibility is to respond when asked to do something by the government such as evacuate NOW, in addition to that, when Bush declared the area a disaster area, that was all the Mayor and Governor needed to order immediate evacuation. The mayor dithered because of concern about legal issues and liability. How much liability do you think the mayor now has? What was HIS responsibility to his people?. 2. The government plan you pointed out calls for aid to reach the disaster are from 24 to 96 hours, that it did well within the parameters set by all. 3. Men and material do not appear instantly, it takes a lot of time to marshall what is needed and get it where it needs to go and transport for that can be a royal pain. 4. Those looting and shooting at the helpers are part and parcel of the problem, you cannot have rescuers shot at while they are responding. Typically, regardless of location or situation, the first responders back off until armed forces (police or military) arrive to stop the killing, then and only then can rescue continue. 5. this too shall pass and the next crisis will occur. If a republican is in charge, the Kos-sacks and DNCers will gripe aplenty. If the Dems are in charge, we will do what we are doing now, pitching in and pointing fingers afterwards if warranted. (see the link on the Daily Kos “Perfect Political Storm” above if you need confirmation) Now, on the lefties bright side, Moveon.org is sponsoring a “Offer a Home” website, which is kinda nice seeing if from folk that typically would rather ***** than do something.
Lastly, I hope you are never in the position that the good folk of NOLA are in, but if you are, I would highly recommend that you do what your government asks and get the hell out before it’s too late. ¿Comprende Amigo?
I already answered your question, above.
No, you did not. Was the Federal Government by its own statements obliged to respond quickly and effectively to prevent loss of life in New Orleans?
The fact that you keep beating
me with the same question indicates to me that you’re not getting the
answer you want to hear.
You have given no answer to that question at all.
I pointed out there are a lot of other elements having to do with this
other than the Federal Government. The levies, the Army Corps of
Engineers……the people in New Orleans or elsewhere that you’re defending for doing nothing…
I’ve made no such defense. Search my comments above.
I have, however, pointed out that the Federal Government took on a responsibility and then failed to live up to it in a timely and effective fashion.
But that’s OK. I’ve seen the light. Government has no responsibility to take care of its citizens.
Insanity is also a trademark of your way of thinking
I ask a question. You duck it. Therefore I am insane. BRILLIANT logic.
Sometimes people are victims because they chose to be.
That stupid ***** who died in her wheelchair outside the Convention Center — she was just asking for it. Thanks for clearing that up for me.
I can see why you are rejoicing. Grover Norquist got his wish. The Federal Government has in fact been made small and ineffective enough that it can be drowned in a bathtub — named New Orleans.
“For the sake of arguement, lets just say that we leave the idiots on the rooftops and all those that refused to evacute to die.”
You just don’t get it yet, do you? Let me spell it out to you ONE MORE TIME —
Follow the bounding ball …
THEY ALL WERE WARNED DAYS AHEAD OF TIME AND WERE GIVEN THE OPPORTUNITY TO LEAVE THE CITY!
What part of that do you not comprehend, Numbnuts???
“Maybe I’m misunderstanding you, but if I’m not – that mindset is pretty absurd.”
It’s not a misunderstanding – it’s a simple case of your BLATANT IGNORANCE AND ASSUMPTIONS — again; refer to my very simple statement above shown in bold — can you find your *** to that statement, or do I have to draw you a damn map???
“Was the Federal Government by its own statements obliged to respond quickly and effectively to prevent loss of life in New Orleans? And did it do so?”
Yes; you’re still a Dumbass Leftie-Communist who has no brilliant logic — especially, when President Bush clearly stated on a live newscast, the Gov’t. already was making plans to mobilize equipment and supplies AFTER THE STORM HIT — but, your brain-cell apparently can’t comprehend that.
One thing about it — you can rest assured that your little rack-buddy, John “HANOI FONDA” Skerry is still sitting in his “Bastan” Townhouse picking his nose; scratching his ***; and changing fingers every 3 minutes, still trying to figure out what the hell to do in this situation … he freaks out, even when “Bastan” gets winds around 25 mph.
At least we have a President who knew what the hell to do, and acted BEFORE THE STORM HIT!
There was no one cause. The failures began long before the hurricane with a gamble that a Category Four or Five hurricane would not strike New Orleans.
Yet on Saturday 28 August, the day before the evacuation was ordered, Mr Brown (the Director of FEMA) did not say that people should leave the city.
All he said was — “There’s still time to take action now, but you must be prepared and take shelter and other emergency precautions immediately.”
The Louisiana Governor Kathleen Blanco said at the same news conference that President Bush had called and personally appealed for a mandatory evacuation.
The night before, National Hurricane Director Max Mayfield had called Mayor Nagin to tell him that an evacuation was needed. Why were these calls necessary?
Because he’s a Dumbass Demoshitter who would rather blame everyone; then call his “Bro”, Jesse JackAss to back up his stupid-***, ignorant loud mouth!
“Nor does Governor Blanco escape criticism. It took until Thursday, for example, for her to sign an order releasing school buses to move the evacuees.”
The president’s defenders point out that it was he who urged an evacuation of New Orleans (he has no legal power to order one) and that he did acknowledge the “unacceptable” pace of the relief effort. Further, they say that aid is now flowing and reconstruction will take place.
Use your one brain-cell and read the whole story
U.S. President George W Bush has cleared his schedule for the rest of September to be ready to deal with the issues related to Hurricane Katrina.
Now, you whining Leftie-Communist Crybabies — don’t spew your stupid bullshit by accusing the President, by stating “he doesn’t care” — again; use your one brain-cell and read where President Bush has Cleared his September schedule for Katrina
Cao and Yatahey,
You are both evil *****.
bwahahaha! hugz and kisses to you, too!
I guess I must be really getting under your skin by not accepting this authoritarian ****! Actually you’re providing me with an immense amount of entertainment, and proving my point about leftists, so please continue beating on a dead horse and making total fools of yourselves (I didn’t think that was possible, but you’re doing it)!
What GM said. Read it carefully and if you don’t get it, I’m sorry.
I haven’t dodged anything, Bradley, you’re just too thick in the head to “get itâ€. I can keep responding and you’ll keep ignoring so where are we?
Do you think you’re convincing anyone with the way you’re approaching this?
You are a leftist authoritarian, lol!!! bwahahahah!
You can’t just let me have my opinion and agree to disagree, you’re trying to put words in my mouth. I simply can’t accept that.
I’ve already answered all of your trollish b/s, yet you continue to perseverate and have a problem with incessant echlalia…like a mental patient.
The government has responsibility to it’s citizens…
Cao says otherwise. How dare you disagree with her?
The government plan you pointed out calls for aid to reach the disaster
are from 24 to 96 hours, that it did well within the parameters set by
all.
Counting from when, exactly? What Federal help had arrived ninety-six hours from that point?
Men and material do not appear instantly, it takes a lot of time to
marshall what is needed and get it where it needs to go and transport
for that can be a royal pain.
Three tons of food ready for delivery by air to refugees in St. Bernard Parish and on Algiers Point sat on the Crescent City Connection bridge Friday afternoon as air traffic was halted because of President Bush’s visit to New Orleans, officials said.
That transport, it really is a *****.
Those looting and shooting at the helpers are part and parcel of the
problem, you cannot have rescuers shot at while they are responding.
When were those shootings first reported? What was being done by the Federal government before that point? Was what the Federals were doing before that time adequate, under the terms of their own National Response Plan?
this too shall pass…
A city is completely flooded, and a whole lot of Democratic voters are dead. No biggie.
Transcript: interview by Tim Russert of Jefferson Parish President Aaron Broussard:”
Wow, you’re obsessed. Take your medicine today?
In case you haven’t noticed, I don’t care what you’re saying about the federal government.
Get a clue from a former Air Force logistics officer:
1. Things can get destroyed far more swiftly than they can get fixed.
2. The United States military can wipe out the Taliban and the Iraqi Republican Guard far more swiftly than they can bring 3 million Swanson dinners to an underwater city through an area the size of Great Britain which has no power, no working ports or airports, and a devastated and impassable road network.
3. You cannot speed recovery and relief efforts up by prepositioning assets since the assets are endangered by the very storm which destroyed the region.
4. We do not yet have teleporter nor replicator technology like you saw on “Star Trek” in college between hookah hits and waiting to pick up your worthless communications degree while the grownups actually engaged in the recovery effort today were studying engineering.
5. Getting people out of the stricken areas is the most pressing concern, since we cannot get enough supplies into it to safely sustain them.
6. Getting the airport, bridges, and roads repaired is the next priority, since the supplies and people needed to fix levees, drain the city, and repair the infrastructure cannot be transported via aircraft. You need to truck them in.
7. Once the infrastructure is repaired, it is vital to get the ports in working order. Equipment and supplies can only be moved into the area in large quantities by sea.
8. Only then can recovery efforts begin in earnest.
9. The above will take weeks and months, not days or hours.
10. No amount of yelling, crying, and mustering of moral indignation will change any of the facts above. Facts are facts. Opinion is cheap.
11. You could do more help actually keeping the damned media’s satellite trucks out of the way of the folks doing the real work.
12. If you must vent your indignation, how about targeting the Louisiana officials who did absolutely nothing to protect their constituents? At least you can help ensure the populace doesn’t elect these clowns again.
Oh yeah. I forgot. You’re not even IN THE UNITED STATES, and you’re just concentrating on your BUSH DERANGEMENT SYNDROME.
I’d like to know how many people stuck in the convention center or the Superdome who demanded gov’t help, have ever actually voted. Isn’t it always the people who demand the most of gov’t, are the ones who do the least to participate.
I mean, if I lived 8-feet below sea level–either by choice or fate–you can bet my tug-boat, I’d know 2 things in life: what our city plan for evacuation is, and what day of the month we rehearse it.
Instead I saw people who thought they lived on a mountain top; who spent a lifetime rehearsing helplessness.
The gov’t can not drop manna from heaven anymore than it can put 50,000 troops in a flooded city overnight.
SSgt Yatahey, I’m talking about the ones that (for the second time) DID evacuate on time.
Cao, thanks for spreading the word to either put up or shut up. I was getting sick of the blame game while people died.
Little Ted Kennedy – go visit John “HANOI FONDA” Skerry; at least I’m in great company here…{ yawn }:mrgreen:
Buggle-tickle; I’m not going to dignify your nagging question, as you still don’t grasp a damn thing.
Bradley, several things: (this from a story YOU linked)
“Complaints about the speed and tactics of the recovery continued Saturday, with Louisiana’s two Democratic senators saying the federal government should have already offered direct cash aid to flood victims.”
Typical Dems….”YOu should have paid money already…let me harp on something for you brad……PERSONAL RESPONSIBILITY!!!
It is going to be the catchphrase of this comment…personal responsibility.
It is what people take when they DON’T believe that the government is there to take care of them for their entire lives….it is something that people who truly understand what this country is about take for themselves and teach their fellow man about….
PERSONAL RESPONSIBILITY!!!!
Itr means being responsible for your own decisions and accepting the consequences and rewards for them. It means when you do something good you get the benefits, and when you do something stupid you suffer the consequences.
Most of those people that stayed in NO (most) had the same news that we did outside of NO….everyone KNEW that a huge hurricane was going to hit….for THREE DAYS!!!
Are you telling me that for three days not ONE of the people left there could have found a way out?
And you want to blame Bush? Blame must fall where it belongs….the mayor, the governor THEN Bush.
And Bush has very little blame…unless you are a race baiting idiot. Personally I am thinking that this may be darwinism at it’s best….let those that don’t possess the IQ and ingenuity to escape oncoming disaster perish in it….hopefully BEFORE they pass along that all too common “Stupid Gene”…..I want you to notice that it is poor people, for the most part, that stayed behind.
Being poor is NOT, at it’s root cause, an economic condition. It is a learned lifestyle and a multi-generational condition that is taught growing up….being taught how to deal with being poor, by growing up poor, is one of the major contributing factors of being poor. Give everyone in the ghetto’s and barrios, slums and projects a hundred grand and within a week the projects will be filled with expensive cars being driven by people wearing 200 jeans and lots of jewelry with no idea of how they are gonna make money for gas next week.
Precious few would get out and make a better life for themselves and their descendents.
At the heart of the NO issue is personal responsibility. I know people that lost everything, but they got out ahead of time and are alive and well.
They took resposibility for themselves and survived. They are sad about the loss of their possessions, their jobs and their homes, but they have their health, their youth and the knowledge that by taking responsibility for themselves they will pick themselves up, dust off and make it again.
They will do it. The government will not do it for them…THEY WILL!!!
Bradley, you are too much of a simpleton to understand that. You would rather blame Bush than listen to reason and logic.
You would rather whine because the world is not the way you wish it to be, instead of seeing it the way it is and dealing with it.
We will never change your mind, because you are a whiny leftist and believe that the government owes you complete safety and a helping hand all the way.
You will never change ours because we are not whiny and we know that Personal Responsibility is our duty, not only to ourselves, but our fellow man, for by taking the burden of yourself upon your own shoulders as much as possible, and lessening the burden upon those that would rush in to save you, you make for a better world.
Bradley, we make for a better world….you make for a global nursery.
Thanks, Jeff. It’s gotta be frustrating where you’re sitting.
I don’t care what you’re saying…
I know. Facts don’t matter at all here.
FEMA won’t accept Amtrak’s help in evacuations
FEMA turns away experienced firefighters
FEMA turns back Wal-Mart supply trucks
FEMA prevents Coast Guard from delivering diesel fuel
FEMA won’t let Red Cross deliver food
FEMA bars morticians from entering New Orleans
FEMA blocks 500-boat citizen flotilla from delivering aid
FEMA fails to utilize Navy ship with 600-bed hospital on board
FEMA to Chicago: Send just one truck
FEMA turns away generators (See entry from 3:32 P.M. by Ben Morris, Slidell mayor)
FEMA: “First Responders Urged Not To Respond”
Since when is it government’s responsibility to take care of people?
Not now, obviously.
So Brad, lives aren’t important to you, just nailing Bush? Or FEMA? I don’t understand.
You’re not offering facts, you’re offering…I’m not sure exactly. A laundry list of things you think someone–the Federal Government, apparently failed those people at? But you fail to recognize-no-even acknowledge that people themselves are responsible for their own health and welfare?
You’re proving exactly what I said about government bureacracy with your own links!~
If you’re going to wait for–socialized medicine, for example, you could die waiting to see a doctor. Same thing goes with just about any other government agency. They’re NOT EFFICIENT. How many times did I say that?
But you ignore it because you’re on a Bush bashing crusade. It’s difficult to comprehend because you also have a litany of other maladies like obsessive compulsive disorder! It’s difficult to get into a conversation with someone who doesn’t even acknowledge the points that are being made on the other side.
I hope you realize you’re about the most extreme case of Bush Derangement Syndrome that I’ve ever seen here. Case closed.
So Brad, lives aren’t important to you
I’ve said nothing of the sort. But I fully understand why you find it necessary to try to divert the discussion at this point. Too many uncomfortable facts…
Those aren’t “uncomfortable facts” those are the rantings of an incoherent maniac. I’ve totally lost touch with any point you’re trying to make, and it’s not because what you’re saying is making me “uncomfortable”, I’m laughing at you for being an obtuse nutball.
It’s difficult to comprehend because you also have a litany of other maladies like obsessive compulsive disorder!
Remember this, folks: Anyone who disagrees with Cao is mentally ill.
Those aren’t “uncomfortable facts†those are the rantings of an incoherent maniac… I’m laughing at you for being a nutball.
Remember this, folks: Anyone who disagrees with Cao is mentally ill.
No, not anyone, just YOU. Would you look back at what you did just now and say that was the product of a sentient calm and stable mind? You continue to step up the prolific posts, the incoherent rants, and claim that they’re full of “facts”. I don’t see “facts” there, no matter how many links you have to what you think in your myopia went wrong. You’re so focused on that one thing that you discount everything else that’s been said. And that’s reasonable? It’s obsessive compulsive!
Remember, folks, where Brad is concerned, he’s the utmost authority and no one is to question it, counter it, or offer a different point of view. And he has the balls to act that way as a guest on someone else’s blog. That’s the ultimate in leftist authoritarianism.
I also notice how you conveniently ignore everyone else who was offering an opinion. You’re beside yourself, foaming at the mouth, ranting and raving and jumping up and down- and I’m not even sure exactly what this is all about…except it stops right now.
Bradley,
While FEMA turned away aid the city was under siege by the same lowlifes that were looting walmarts (including cops) and sniping at police stations and laying seige to hospitals.
I would have turned away aid also. It keeps the caregivers and first responders SAFE from idiots that are trying to kill them for no apparent reason. If the city had been secured before aid was let in then maybe some of the contractors attached to the army corp of engineers would still be alive instead of shot to death by jumping, cowardly NO cops that FINALLY decided to do their jobs.
Too bad some of the people they shot to death weren’t some of those looters that were taking large TVs to “feed their kids” with.”
He’s not listening, Kender, he’s concentrating on one thing…that’s his hatred of Bush. Reason and facts go out the window because he only acknowledges his own point of view and no one else’s. Not someone you can even have a rational conversation with; he just keeps turning up the psycho.
Notice how no matter what I said he ignored it and went back to his original question, which I answered in numerous ways? On top of that, he ignores everyone else who’s commenting in response to his vacuous diatribes, which is equally as–Un.be.lievable.
Even funnier,
, the title to this post was “find a way to help or shut up.”